Sectarianism or nationalist vs colonialist?
Before the class began, I was mostly aware of the conflict in Northern Ireland as a religious one. After beginning the readings and such, I (and I think most/all of the class) began to think of the conflict in the terms of a struggle for national self-determination (albeit perhaps more complicated than some, due to the double minority situation). As we began to actually meet people on the ground in NI, this was reinforced. Many of the people we met with, on both sides, began our conversation by saying "For starters, this is not a conflict about religion."
After a while, though, you start to wonder why everyone has to keep saying this; the lady doth protest too much! Meanwhile, you realize that what violence you do still hear about seems to be of a more straightforward sectarian nature: gangs stopping people on the street and asking them to pronounce the letter "H", bar fights, etc. Add to this the growing segregation, both in terms of housing and socialization (a number of people I met were quite straightforward about never going to bars known to be frequented by members of the other religion/culture ), and you start to feel that maybe sectarianism really is more at the root of things. Now of course the colonial/local struggle is going to exacerbate sectarian divides in some ways. But ironically it seems that as the struggle for self-determination moves from violent to peaceful, the prejudices and resentments increase (as usual this is a generalization that doesn't hold for everyone).
I'd love to hear some feedback on both this issue and my use of parentheses.
After a while, though, you start to wonder why everyone has to keep saying this; the lady doth protest too much! Meanwhile, you realize that what violence you do still hear about seems to be of a more straightforward sectarian nature: gangs stopping people on the street and asking them to pronounce the letter "H", bar fights, etc. Add to this the growing segregation, both in terms of housing and socialization (a number of people I met were quite straightforward about never going to bars known to be frequented by members of the other religion/culture ), and you start to feel that maybe sectarianism really is more at the root of things. Now of course the colonial/local struggle is going to exacerbate sectarian divides in some ways. But ironically it seems that as the struggle for self-determination moves from violent to peaceful, the prejudices and resentments increase (as usual this is a generalization that doesn't hold for everyone).
I'd love to hear some feedback on both this issue and my use of parentheses.
posted by Bartholow at 7:09 AM
3 Comments:
Hey Dave,
You're not the only one scratching his head over this one.
http://www.sluggerotoole.com/index.php/weblog/comments/troubles_down_sectarian_attacks_up/
I still think, however, that the better question is not "Is/was this a religious war or an anti-imperialist one?" but "What role does/did religion play in this conflict?" The latter might allow us to build a richer account, in which religion is one of many factors in a quite complex conflict.
In addition, I encourage people to think about the Troubles (and any armed conflict) in terms of processes and contingencies, i.e. what might begin as simple sectarian strife might turn into some quite different after the players redefine the boundaries, which might get redrawn again as a consequence of some event that realigns the relations of the players.
One might also consider how the players tactically employ acts of sectarian violence as a way of putting pressure on their rivals, e.g. the UDA/UFF knew in the 70s that they had to go 'beyond the religious divide,' but at the same time used sectarian violence to 'out-terrorize the terrorists.' Note also how the INLA advocated 'inclusiveness' in the struggle, but that didn't stop them from shooting up a Protestant church.
Finally, when thinking about the current sectarian streetfighting, it's important to remember that one big part of the solution in NI was segregation (housing, schools, etc.) along sectarian lines. It's not much of a leap to say that the way we live structures the way we fight.
I was thinking something similar to Jim, just with different and less words. One cannot expect a conflict that has lasted for decades to be centered on one problem, or the same problems. Religion has and still does play a role in the conflict--it is embedded in the culture. People all over the world associate religion with a set of morals and "rules"--just like we do here in the states. As much as we like to separate our government from religion, many of our laws are based on values commonly associated with Christianity. An obvious example of this would be the ten commandments. Now I cannot remember what all ten are (after how many years of Catholic school??), but I know you're not supposed to kill, or steal, or lie (coinciding with standard U.S. laws). So, as seen in Northern Ireland, it is hard in a world filled with religion to construct a completely secular conflict.
That being said, I think part of the reason everyone we met with made a point of telling us that it was not a sectartian conflict was because they wanted to make it clear that the conflict is not centered around religion-- even though it has been portrayed that way. Many people in a group also share a common religion, so it's hard to take religion out of the picture. Would doing so aid the discussion of other issues they might be able to agree on, or would it just bury the problem, only to surface later much worse than before? -Or do they protest too much?
Culture changes over time, and it sometimes seemed that people were holding on to the past they identified with, making it hard to move foreward with the changing times. How can you find a place in the middle between losing one's heritage, and moving foreward to new,changing opportunities.
Good points guys. I guess what I was trying to say was not that the conflict is in fact sectarian, but that it almost feels like some people are in denial of the existence of a sectarian component, which still needs to be addressed. As usual, "it's complicated."
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